Now for the fun part! As I explained in Part Seven I am not able to go through with the complete respray of our project VN at the moment due to a re-occuring back injury but I am hoping that by showing you the basics that I was taught on one panel you will be able to ’scale it up’ if you are doing a full respray. Fingers crossed I will be able to hold a spray gun for more than 10 minutes at a time in the near future.
At this stage we should have a nice primered surface ready for the topcoats, the car masked up and the panels wiped down with Wax and Grease Remover or Prepsol.
Time to fire up the compressor and check our pressure setting. When spraying the undercoat I prefer to use anywhere up to about 50psi of air pressure, but when it comes to the topcoat I believe a lower pressure is better as it limits the amount of overspray. There is nothing worse than spraying the roof for example and finding that you have a ugly, rough stripe down the middle where the overspray has mixed with the wet paint. My preference for topcoat is around 30psi, but once again this is only my preference and you should first check the instructions that came with your paint and also experiment a bit first to find the best setting for you. Also be sure to drain any condensation that has built up in the compressor’s tank or in the water trap if you have one.
Next item on the agenda is preparing the paint. Most acrylic paints are thinned at a ratio of one part paint to two and a half parts thinner. I always use Premium Thinners for the top coat instead of the general purpose stuff, it costs a little more but does it make a difference? To be honest I don’t know! I was taught this way and have never tried just using general purpose for thinning the top coat, just a habit I guess.
When I’m ready to paint I usually mix up almost one litre of paint and thinners in an old spray gun pot (using a clean steel ruler for measuring out the two parts), double check the air pressure, half-fill the gun and we’re ready to go.
Just a quick note on air pressure, you will notice that even though you set the pressure at one level, when you pull the trigger on the spray gun the pressure will drop by a few psi. To combat this set your pressure slightly above the pressure that you want to spray at and by the time the paint hits the panel it will be at the desired pressure. This is probably not absolutely necessary, I’m just a bit pedantic when it comes to spraying.
Like when spraying undercoat, the trick is to keep the gun as square to the surface as you can, at the same distance away through the entire stroke and keep an eye on the ‘wet edge’ of the paint to be sure you are getting adequate coverage. A good idea is to have a portable fluro light that you can move around with you as you spray and when set up in the right position it can make following the wet edge a lot easier.
I made the video below to try and show you how following that wet edge of the paint is the best way of ensuring that you don’t go too thick in some areas and that you don’t end up with patchy dry areas of paint ( and to show you my flash new pair of chinese safety boots 
). Following this edge is vitally important when doing the second and third coats of colour as it is almost impossible (depending on the colour) to see how the coat is being applied. The video is of the second coat being applied, I was hoping to video all three coats but some dufus, that’ll be me, kept standing in front of the camera.
With any luck your three coats of colour have turned out nice and even and have a bit of a shine to them. If the paint has turned out rough or almost sand paper like you have applied it too ‘dry’ and need to focus on laying down ‘heavier’ coats, likewise if the paint has some runs in it or has ‘built up’ areas you need to go a little lighter. The beauty of Acrylic is that once it is completely dry (an hour or two in the sun) you can then go along and wet sand any areas that you are not happy with.
Although the surface of our front guard turned out pretty good I left it in the sun for a few hours and then wet-sanded it with 1200 paper to give it a nice flat, even look before applying the clear. As you can see from the photo doing this removes just about all of the gloss the paint had but once the clear is applied the gloss will be back better than ever.
Applying the clearcoat is exactly the same process as with the colour coats. Once again I am doing three coats as I expect to remove a bit with the buffing and polishing process.
That’s where we will leave this part of the never-ending story! I will let the paint dry overnight and put the panel out in the sun for a while tomorrow before going through the final step of cutting and polishing. If you have any questions or concerns we have a board setup at the Advice Forum on this subject and so far it’s looking pretty bare so feel free to post your questions there.
Stay Tuned for Part Nine, Cutting and Polishing our new paint job.
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41 Users Responded in " How To Respray A Car – Part Eight – Topcoats "
Hi i have just found you and your fantastic web advise, a huge thank you.As i am an old gimmer at fifty i am not a complete novice but the last time i spayed a car was twenty years ago and things have moved on since then.My main reason for searching the web was to see if you are meant to rub down the colour with say 1200 wet and dry before applying the lacquer, as i think i got a little excited with the air pressure and the bonnet is a little shall we say orange peely (WOOPS) and at seventy pounds a litre i need to get it looking good fairly quickly Regards Keith
Hey Keith,
Thanks for the positive feedback! Muchly appreciated!
Personally, and I’m no professional at this, but I highly recommend wet sanding the colour with 1200 or even 1000 grade paper before applying the lacquer (I’m asuming that we are talking about the clear top coat here) as the end result is so much better than simply spraying straight over the top.
I’ve seen guys struggle with heaps of orange peel and try and buff the surface to a smooth, shiny look after the clear has been applied and in my opinion it never looks as good as taking the time to sand the surface flat or at least as flat as you can reasonably get it before applying the clear coat.
If you have managed to get a decent amount of paint on the surface – two to three good coats, you should have no worries sanding the majority of your orange peel out, just be careful of any corners or sharp lines!
As I said I’m no professional but after ten years or so and too many stuff up’s to remember I think I have a reasonable amount of knowledge on this subject and I hope this advise works well for you.
Thanks for the reply Craig, since first mailing i have watched the various video clips etc and cannot help but smile when advised to put the items in the sun to warm, as it never shines in England, only rains, so it is a case of shutting all the doors and choking for a while,but tomorrow i will lower the pressure and apply the clear coat, you watch i will just get used to the acrylic way of things and they will go over to water based.Regards Keith
Hi,
Very useful info’ and many thanks.
We are painting a 4wd and not inclined to go to the expense of a clear lacquer finishing coat. Intend to simply buff the final acrylic colour coat.
Have been told that the ratio of thinner to paint changes the level of the finished natural sheen after you lay the paint on, but before you start buffing it. If this is so, can anyone advise what ratio of paint to thinners should I use to get the highest possible natural finished sheen?
Hi Keith again, i used one and a half thinners to paint but be warned i am no expert,however it didn’t seem to matter(its below zero here) as it ended up dull, and i had to use a clear coat to achieve a shin only to be told by her indoors that the colour was darker than the surrounding paint ( i only sprayed the bonnet) so with a smile i returned to the paint supplier and convinced him that the spay was darker than the original standard factory colour,new paint in hand i returned home and started to hand sand,first through the lacquer then through the various layers of paint and yes you have guessed it the more i rubbed the lighter the colour became what a cock up.Back out with the spray gun and spray again more thinners this time and lower pressure this in turn resulted in a much finer coat and a better finish not to mention the color match,if i ever get the use of my arm back i may go down the pub or even finish her car off, watch this space. Regards Keith
Hi just found your site. I am spraying in QLD, 32 Degrees C, under a shaded carport and humid, need to adjust air pressure due to a sand paper turnout. Anyway rubbed back, applied topcoat clear, went milky white apparantly to humid, I was told if this occurs to add a retarder to the paint and clear top coat, Do you know anything about this. I also think my gun is not up to scratch as I cant seem to get the flow and paint volume right, are the top loader gravity fed guns better than the syphon fed guns. Thank you
Hi Douglas,
I also have heard of using a retarder in humid conditions, but I have not had any experience using it myself. Perhaps a chat with the guys at your local automotive paint suppliers might head you in the right direction. If you are in Brisbane the guys at Peninsula Paint Supplies (Redcliffe) are quite knowledgable. Their phone number is (07) 3284 8466.
As far as the Spray Gun is concerned, when I first started dabbling in painting cars I persisted with a suction feed gun for a while and it wasn’t until I bought a gravity feed gun that my results where anything to be proud of! The flow and finish that you achieve is far superior in my opinion, although I do know of a couple of professional painters that use suction feed guns but I guess their level of expertise is a lot higher than you and I.
I bought the gun that I have been using for the last couple of years off Ebay for around $80 from memory and it gives a nice flat finish with relative ease and a (very!) average skill level. In my opinion it is money well spent.
Hope this helps and if you have any other questions feel free to leave another comment and I will do my best to answer it.
Hi,
I have lost total control over the comments and emails I’ve repsonded to after taking a few days off so please accept my apology if I have already answered your question!
I have successfully used acrylic without a clearcoat on a number of occasions using the same 1:1 1/2 thinning ratio as used when applying a clear over the top. I do suggest though that you give the car at least three coats ( four is ideal from my experiences) as the buffing process removes a bit of paint and it may get a bit thin on the edges.
Hope this helps and good luck with your respray.
Hi Craig just a quick one to say happy new year to all in hotter climates than England.I have now finished the current car and we have a saying in England about working your fingers to the bone, i have achieved just that when rubbing down the paint, i thought i had caught my fingers on the sharp edges but quickly realised i had rubbed through the layers of skin on the first three fingers of my right hand and that’s why they would not stop bleeding for 24 hours so i purchased an electric polisher sander and i must say its the best 37 pounds i have ever spent.Back to the paint i am having some problems with colour matching, its metallic and i seem to be able to achieve various color variations from the same supply of paint , is it the paint to thinner mix i wonder, and how crucial is this when working with metallics base ct Regards Keith
Brilliant site and a superbly written article!!! I am making an old Ford look a little prettier then its current rusty state, and having made a fair job at filling panels and rust removal I am now on to spraying.
The paint scheme is clear over a metallic black colour, but I have a few questions.
In your article you mentioned that before applying the clear coats, you wet-sanded the final colour layer with 1200 paper to give it a nice flat, even look before applying the clear. If I do this with a metallic paint, would the effect still be good post clear coat applications, or should I cut ‘n’ polish the final colour layer up before clear coating. I only ask as the thought of flattening the final colour layer then clear coating gives me the impression that the paint would still be dull looking under a nice glossy shiny layer… You can see my inexperience showing !!!
Hey Ritchie,
I’m no expert either mate, but from what I have found if you lightly wet and sand the final colour coat it removes any over-spray and ‘flattens’ the paint out nicely and laying the clear coat on brings it all back ’shiny’ again. Don’t ask me why it happens this way and I do understand where you are coming from, if you have a nice shiny paint surface to lay the clear coat on it should be twice as shiny, right?
Well in my experiences you achieve a much nicer finish using the method I described but of course a bit of experimentation never hurts. The front guard in the article was painted using a metallic, so it does work as well with metallic’s as well as flat colours.
I would stay away from cut-n-polish on the final colour coat as the clear coat won’t adhere to the polished surface. The surface needs to be clean and wax/polish free for it to ’stick’ to the colour.
I hope this helps to answer your questions, as I said I’m no expert either, the articles are the result of many years of experimentation, some good but a lot bad too I can tell you!
Thanks for the positive feedback, muchly appreciated!
Many thanks for the swift reply Craig – by cut n polish I meant cutting and polishing using progressive finer grades of paper, but I understand your advise perfectly.
I will indeed flatten back the final colour layer to remove the small orange peeling I tend to get before clear coating. I guess this will as you say produce better results than also just building layer after layer of colour, then over laying the clear coats to then try and flatten the last clear coat layer.
I guess the next thing is when might you be drafting your next / 9th chapter as that will cover a lot of other questions I have in my mind regarding clear coat cutting and polishing etc!!
Cheers
Richie
Hey Richie,
My bad, I misunderstood what you meant by cut and polish, but thankfully you understood the rest of my ramblings!!
Bit hard to give a definite time frame on the final part of this article, I’m having trouble holding my coffee cup for any length of time at the moment, let alone a machine buff! I’m going through some fairly intensive accupuncture at the moment which I’m hoping will give me some relief and let me get back to some sort of normal life. Either that or I will make a really good pin cushion!
If you have any particular questions about the final stage shoot them over and I’ll do my best to answer them, and I’ll definately send you an email as soon as Part Nine is posted. I will try for sometime this coming week, I’m going bananas sitting around doing bugger all!
Thanks for your info and the movie was very helpful, I do have one question. After using 1200 wet paper to flatten my third coat before the clear coat, what do I clean the surface with ? prepsol again?
what about the buffing /polishing section.
thanks again Allan.
Hi Allan,
Prepsol is fine for cleaning the surface prior to the clear coats going on. I usually wipe down the area with a clean cloth to remove the majority of the residue and then apply the Prepsol and then wipe off with another clean cloth. Not sure if that is the way the professionals do it but it certainly works ok for me.
The buffing/polishing article will be done as soon as I am able to hold the buff for any length of time. I’ve got disc/vertebrae problems at the moment which are causing a great deal of pain when trying to lift or hold anything. If you like I’ll send you an email as soon as it’s done.
hey, thanks for making all this information available free to the public. good on you, just a quick question, i have recently re-sprayed my mirage. all the pre sanding and priming went absoloutly fine. no problems what so ever. however my colour paint finish was not rough, just not glossy at all… i partially took your advise to wet sand this coat and then i applied topcoat… the colour is just right on the car but the topcoat came out a little matte. i have tried wet sanding for a nice glossy final finish starting with 1000 then moving onto 1200 then 1500 and im now considering using 2000. i have tried this on small areas of my car and then used liquid cut and polish to give it a shine. this has made one pannel look fine but the others are a bit pants. do you have any further advise on how to get a nice glossy finish? thanx
Hey Kris,
Glad to hear that you found the info useful. I have a couple of questions for you, I assume that you used an acrylic paint is this correct? Also have you tried a machine buff/polisher with a cutting compound (rather than cut and polish) on the dull areas of paint?
If you can answer those questions it will give me a better idea of what may work to get the best shine out of the paint.
hi craig,
first i would like to say a big thank you for this write up. it has been very useful. i am about to start painting a commodore to learn the basics. i have a question though. how much paint will i need to buy? i have asked a few people and all gotten different answers. the people at the paint store told me i would only need 2L (and to thin it at the same 1:1 1/2 ratio you used, which would take it up to 5L). my father in law does a bit of painting and said i would need close to 4L. and the same goes for the clear coat. just want to get some other opinions before i get the paint so i don’t get caught short on a weekend painting when the paint shop is shut, but then i don’t want to spend twice as much as i have to.
you did say in the article that about half a litre of thinned primer was about right, so i had that bit sussed.
thanks again, marc
Hey Marc,
For a car the size of a Commodore ( and assuming that you are using acrylic rather than 2-pack ) around 4 litres of colour will be needed to cover the car completely in two to three coats. A minimum of four litres of thinners is needed also, using the 1:1 1/2 mixing ratio and gun clean-up etc etc.
I usually grab a can of general purpose thinners for thinning the primer and cleaning up and a tin of premium thinners for the top coats. I think the premium thinners makes a difference to the top coats but please yourself there, it could all just be in my head!!
Good luck with it and if there is anything else I may be able to help you with please let me know.
I have read your remarks to diy spraypainting a car and it has been great. keep up the good work – cant wait for part 9. thanks ken
Hi Craig,
Can you please tell me what brand of paint you use? I am looking for a good acrylic silver.
Cheers
Hi Josh,
For the VN paint (and the majority of the spraying that we do) I simply went down to Autobahn and had them mix up 4 litres. They use Dulux paint down the road from us and there is a guy there that is really switched on regarding mixing the colours.
That colour we used is Asteroid Silver, GM Series 1 and 2 VN colour if your interested.
nice stuff brother good to see the DYI going strong
Cheers mate
Big thanks to craig
I have just finished painting my Wolseley 680 1950 mark 2 its come up very glossy i will wait a couple of weeks before i cut and polish it Craigs advice was fantastic one thing i found a bit tricky was the roof trying to get in to the centre but it all come out well in the end
Thanks craig
Well done champ
I had better pull my finger out and do Part Nine – Final Prep and Cut N Polish.
Hi, I have seen your video on applying the colour coat and the the sanding, before the top coat. The question I have is why do you do it this way and other videos I have seen don’t sand before the topcoat is applied?
Secondly, my color coat doesn’t appear to have a lot of “gloss” to it, is this normal? It’s acrylic metalic paint.
Cheers
Hi Steve,
The only reason that I sand before applying the topcoat is to remove any built-up over-spray and to give the final coat a nice flat surface to adhere to. Doing this is not absolutely necessary, I just like to get the best shine I can with the least amount of cutting and polishing.
In regards to the gloss of your topcoat, any acrylic metalic won’t bring out a good shine until you apply a couple of coats of clear and then cut and polish this clear coat.
If you have a look at the two pictures towards the bottom of this post you will see the dull look of the final colour coat and below it the shine once three coats of clear was applied.
Also if you have a digital camera and can send me some shots showing how the paint looks I may be able to help you a bit more. A picture speaks a thousand words as they say!
Just want to say many thanks.
Im only 17 and fixing up my first car.
This was a real help when it came to paint and panel
cant wait for part nine
Hi Craig
This is a great DIY guide, very clear instructions and information!!!
One question, what alternatives are there to using a spraying technique… would using a foam roller, or foam brushes to apply the paint be possible… would this work with acrylic paint to get a good finish?
thanks
Matt
Hi Matt,
To be honest I have never been down the path of rolling or brushing on automotive paint. I did read once of a guy that used marine paint on a car and brushed it on using a “flatenning agent” in the paint and apparently it came up quite nice but I don’t imagine that acrylic would turn out real well unless you were spraying it.
Maybe some of our readers have had experience with this and will be better qualified to answer your question.
Hi Craig,
Thanks for your reply.
I’m sure you’ve already answered my questions in earlier forums, but i can’t seem to find them…so here it goes
How long do you wait between
- each coat of colour
- final colour coat & clear lacquer
- each coat of lacquer
Would an airless spray gun be suitable to use for acrylic automotive paint?
Can you explain the process of machine buffing/polishing with a cutting compound? What to use and how…or is that for a later tutorial post?
Thanks for your help and advice
Matt
Apologies for the late reply Matt. The normal waiting period between coats (for both colour and the clear lacquer) is ten minutes however it is advisable to check the instructions on the can before taking that as gospel. Some manufacturers have different times but from my experience the more common brands of paint all need around the ten minute mark for the paint to ‘flash off’ before the next coat.
As far as I am aware a airless spray gun is not suitable for spraying acrylic, but please don’t take that as gospel either! Perhaps a chat with someone that sells auto paint might shed some more light on that one? I just don’t have the answer I’m sorry.
Regarding the buffing and polishing, I have a couple of panels in the workshop waiting for me to get my butt down there and do the final tutorial post in the series but as I’m having a heap of drama with pinched nerves in my back I’m a bit hesitant to pick up the buffer and get stuck into it. I’ll do my best to get it done before the end of next week and I’ll send you an email as soon as I get it done.
Hi Craig,
Thanks for the brilliant clear instructions, they really make the prospect of painting for the first time seem much more doable!
I’m currently restoring an old VW kombi panel van to get it looking slick before I sell it, and have done the sanding and filler stages so far. I read here that primer can absorb moisture so a top coat should be applied soon after. However, I was planning to do all the prep on the van (almost done!), spray it in primer, and sell it on the premise that it would be ready for the new owner to get it finished it in their favourite colour (or their company colours if using it as a promotional vehicle).
The problem is, I still want to be able to drive it myself in the mean time, is there anything I can do to stop the primer absorbing moisture but still be ready to paint on weeks later? Or is it ok to just have primer for a while as long as it gets dried out thoroughly and sanded back a bit prior to the colour coat?
Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us first-timers, your advice is very helpful!
Cheers
Sam
Cheers for the positive feedback Sam!
If you are only talking a couple of weeks that the van will be in primer personally I wouldn’t be overly concerned. The reason that it is not a good idea to leave it that way for any great length of time is because the primer absorbs moisture and any repairs or sanding that has gone back to bare metal will start rusting and as you can imagine having rust under a nice new paintjob ain’t good!
I don’t think a couple of weeks will affect it too much, but if you notice rust starting under the primer you could always sand that area back a bit and reapply some primer. There are some non-porous primers available but to be honest I have not used them and I’m not sure how expensive they are but it might be worth an inquiry at your local paint supplier.
Thanks Craig,
I appreciate you answering so fast! I’ve been looking into it a bit more and think that it should be alright if I do it all in primer and then put a thin layer of topcoat to finish it. That way I can drive it in the weather without worrying about moisture getting in and affecting the bare metal underneath. Then if the next owner wants a new colour there would me minimal sanding needed to get it to a paintable surface.
I asked at my local auto paint shop (Milsomes in Ferntree Gully, Melbourne) and the guy there was incredibly knowledgeable about the different options. Etching primer is apparently waterproof and could be another possibility.
Thanks again for your advice and the great DIY guide!
Cheers
Sam
No worries Sam! Glad the guide has come in handy. Personally just for peace of mind I would throw a coat of top coat paint over the primer and, as you say, there would be a minimal amount of work for the new owner to get it back to the primer stage.
I think that would be your best option, but if it is only going to be a couple of weeks that you are driving it I wouldn’t be devastated if it did get wet, if you know what I mean! I was under the impression that Etching Primer was not waterproof, but they may have changed it since I last used it 15-20 years ago.
Hi there
Im currently toying with the idea of doing a full respray to a car, i have sprayed a set of alloy wheels in the past but not plastic and metal body panels is it possible to get a good even finish using acrylic base and acrylic clear coat, if i was to spray the car a panel at a time?
thanks
loz
forgot to mention its out of spray cans
cheers again
Hi,
Personally I wouldn’t attempt to spray the car with cans, it is just about impossible to get the amount of coverage that you need for a good job. If access to a compressor and spray gun is an issue you could try one of the equipment hire places for a quote on this for a day or two.
Regards,
Craig
thats what i thought
cheers
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